Amy Jungk, VP Sales, Old World Spices & Seasonings - Encore Afterhours
The central theme of this podcast episode revolves around the intricate process of developing new seasoning products and the associated challenges within the culinary market. We engage in an enlightening discourse with Amy Young from Old World Spices, who elucidates the complexities inherent in the creation and commercialization of spices, rubs, and sauces. Through our dialogue, we uncover the sobering reality that less than 20% of new products developed in the lab successfully reach the market, emphasizing the necessity for patience and persistence in this competitive industry. Furthermore, we explore the importance of branding and market presence, particularly for newcomers seeking to establish themselves amidst established competitors. This episode serves as an invaluable resource for those aspiring to navigate the multifaceted world of culinary product development.
Companies mentioned in this episode:
- Painted Hills Natural Beef
- Old World Spices
- Jack Daniels
- Fire and Smoke Society
- PK Grills
- Blackstone
- Loot and Booty
- Boar's Night Out
- Bobby Flay
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
OP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy
Transcript
This is Barbecue Nation After Hours.
Speaker A:The conversation that took place after the show ended.
Speaker A:Hey, everybody, it's jt and this is a special version of Barbecue Nation.
Speaker A:It is brought to you in part by Painted Hills Natural Beef.
Speaker A:Beef you can be proud to serve your family and friends.
Speaker A:That's Painted Hills Natural Beef.
Speaker A:Hey, everybody.
Speaker A:Welcome to After Hours here on the Barbecue Nation.
Speaker A:I'm JT along with Leanne Whippen, and today we've got Amy Young with us from Old World Spices.
Speaker A:And we've gotten quite an education.
Speaker A:If you listen to the.
Speaker A:The first part of the show there on spices, rubs, sauces, there's a process, and if you think you're gonna just jump right into it, I would suggest maybe you contact Amy or listen to that show we just did very carefully, because there's a lot to it.
Speaker A:So one thing that we'll start on a fairly serious note, Amy, if that's all right with you, what would you say the success to failure ratio is when somebody is trying to create a new seasoning and to actually get it to the market?
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:So we have meetings literally this morning talking about processes and amount of time that we spend with our lab and R and D, how many projects they go through a month.
Speaker B:I think we're looking at a quarter.
Speaker B:We said in the last quarter, how many new products has the lab developed and how many of those have been commercialized?
Speaker B:And I think it was less than 20%.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:So, you know, you do get.
Speaker B:You have to remember, though, so some of these people, let's take a bigger brand.
Speaker B:Let's take somebody like, you know, the Jack Daniels Rubs, which are going to be more grocery.
Speaker B:And, you know, in Walmart, maybe it's the Fire and Smoke Society, which I believe is part of PK Grills, Blackstone has come out with their rub, you know, so they're going to come to us and they're going to say, hey, we have a Walmart presentation coming up.
Speaker B:We need six new products to show them.
Speaker B:So we're going to develop six products for them.
Speaker B:They're going to show it to Walmart.
Speaker B:Walmart.
Speaker B:Or say, yeah, we'll take those two.
Speaker B:That's very, very typical when you're trying to present to a big retailer and they want fresh, new things all the time, but it doesn't guarantee you they're going to take it.
Speaker B:Now, on the barbecue hobbyist side, so we're going hardware, outdoor living.
Speaker B:It depends on if you already have an established brand.
Speaker B:So if Sterling Smith at Loot and Booty comes out with a new rub, and those retailers know that, man.
Speaker B:They can't keep his Jolly Roger rub on the shelf.
Speaker B:It's selling so fast.
Speaker B:They're going to take a chance and they're going to bring in his new one.
Speaker B:If you are a boar's night out, White lightning, anything, they're going to take you in because, again, they can hardly keep it in stock.
Speaker B:It moves so fast.
Speaker B:If you're new, it's going to take you a little time, and you have to be patient.
Speaker B:You have to work it.
Speaker B:You have to be promoting yourself.
Speaker B:You have to be online cooking with your staff, showing people how to use it.
Speaker B:But be patient.
Speaker B:It's not that it won't be successful, but it's not going to open doors overnight.
Speaker A:That's good to know.
Speaker A:So if you, Amy, could cook and then dine with a historical figure, who would it be?
Speaker B:Oh, wow.
Speaker B:I cook the meal with the historical.
Speaker A:Figure, or you cook for them, but it's just you and them.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker B:Oh, my gosh.
Speaker B:You got to make me really think about this one.
Speaker B:And I don't know what I would cook for her, but I've always had this strong affinity to Mother Teresa, and because she sacrificed and gave so much, I think to be able to give a meal or share a meal with her and to give something to her would be a really special moment.
Speaker A:Okay, well, then you already answered the second part of the question, which is what would the menu be?
Speaker A:And it wouldn't be Taco Bell, but you're not sure.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:That's really a pretty good answer.
Speaker A:Have you ever eaten haggis?
Speaker B:What?
Speaker B:Yeah, what these are.
Speaker B:Can you spell that and use it in a sentence, please?
Speaker A:Have you ever gone to Scotland and eaten some haggis where you have to prick the boil and then do that?
Speaker B:I've never picked a boil, no.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:You know what haggis is?
Speaker B:I have no.
Speaker B:Obviously, I have no idea.
Speaker B:I don't.
Speaker B:Please educate me.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:Here you go, ladies.
Speaker A:You take a sheep stomach and you clean it and then you fill it full of other body parts like liver and kidneys and all that stuff.
Speaker A:And then you put some vegetables and stuff in there and you kind of sew it up and you.
Speaker A:You boil it, and then you can actually take it out of the boil and bake it if you want, but you got to kind of boil it.
Speaker A:And that's when they call, prick the boil to see if it's done.
Speaker A:It's a nasty shit.
Speaker A:I would never.
Speaker A:I would never advise anybody to eat it.
Speaker A:A lot of people over there in the UK like it, especially in the northern part where Scotland is.
Speaker A:But anyway, that's what haggis is.
Speaker A:It comes from back in the days when they couldn't waste any body parts.
Speaker B:Can you delete that question, please?
Speaker B:Because it's like lunchtime here and I suddenly not have to hear this again, and I. I just can't.
Speaker A:You can't do that.
Speaker A:Well, if we ever get somebody who golfs on here for, for a living, that they will, they will know what haggis is, especially if they've been over to the British Open or the Irish Open or something.
Speaker A:Okay, what's the hottest new thing you out there to help people with their cooking or their barbecue?
Speaker B:You know, there's been a lot of talk lately about the flat grills, like the, like the PK grills, and people that are maybe afraid of the fire, learning to cook things on a flat top grill to kind of get them into a backyard experience.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:I think we're going to see.
Speaker B:I think we're going to see those really take off.
Speaker B:And I think if you do have a barbecue rubber sauce, if you can come up with more recipes and ways to show people how to do things that aren't as intimidating like on a flat top, that's going to be gold.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:You got that land.
Speaker A:You're going to start doing that?
Speaker B:Yes, I've done a few.
Speaker A:I know you have.
Speaker A:Amy, if he started your career all over again, what would you do?
Speaker A:That's Leanne question.
Speaker A:So if you.
Speaker B:That is my question.
Speaker B:Before I got into business with my father 32 years ago, I was actually a high school special ed teacher.
Speaker B:And I took a break from teaching to help my dad out, always with the intention of going back.
Speaker B:And so I don't know.
Speaker B:I see.
Speaker B:I can't afford the pay cut, unfortunately.
Speaker B:And God bless you teachers and everybody who devotes their lives to these children.
Speaker B:So, you know, if I could make my millions of dollars in the spice industry and be able to walk away and go back, I would.
Speaker B:I would go back to teaching.
Speaker B:Interesting.
Speaker A:That's probably why you get along with the barbecue people so well, because you have that special training.
Speaker A:Because.
Speaker B:Yes, Jeff, Teaching.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:I specialized in behavior disorders and learning disabilities.
Speaker B:So, you know, hang out with.
Speaker B:That's why I hang out with this crew.
Speaker A:If.
Speaker A:Well, we could just wrap it up right there.
Speaker A:We have our answer.
Speaker A:If you could work with one of your barbecue heroes, who would it be?
Speaker B:Someone I haven't worked with yet.
Speaker A:Anybody you want.
Speaker A:There's no right answers, but.
Speaker B:Well, you know, as odd as this sounds, because I have met him, and I did one of his TV shows when he was traveling around the country, but I haven't developed products with him.
Speaker B:I'd actually love to work with Bobby.
Speaker B:Fl.
Speaker B:Love that.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker B:Well, Leanne, he was one of the kindest people.
Speaker B:He came in here to Kansas City filming a show called.
Speaker B:I think it was called Barbecue America or Barbecue Across America.
Speaker B:And he was visiting barbecue restaurants and themed.
Speaker B:There was even a pet bakery that did barbecue ribs here in town that he came to see.
Speaker B:And, yeah, his producers had called us up because they said they're going into all these Kansas City barbecue restaurants, and they'd ask everybody, hey, what's the secret for your rub?
Speaker B:And, oh, I can't tell you.
Speaker B:I'll have to kill you, you know, was kind of the very tired joke.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:But he said the one thing he kept noticing was he kept seeing Old World spices labels and all these boxes in the kitchens.
Speaker B:So he called me and said, who are you and what do you do?
Speaker B:What's your connection here?
Speaker B:So I told him who we were, and then we had, you know, this blending operation.
Speaker B:And he said, well, can I come down?
Speaker B:Can I see your place?
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:So now, this was his producer.
Speaker B:This wasn't Bobby yet.
Speaker B:So the producer came down, he toured her place he liked, and he goes, can I bring Bobby in and shoot a segment here?
Speaker B:Sure.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:So he did.
Speaker B:He came in and actually had to hang out with him for a couple of days because they used me in a couple other segments that they were doing locally.
Speaker B:And he said, oh, my God, where can I go?
Speaker B:Go get good sushi in this town.
Speaker B:So I made some reservations and took the crew out for sushi.
Speaker B:And this is when I fell in love with Bobby as a human being.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:He, sitting in this restaurant, asked if they could make the bartender can make a socatini.
Speaker B:And the waiter said, well, let me go find out.
Speaker B:And he came back and said, no, he doesn't know how to make it.
Speaker B:He goes, well, does he mind if I go behind the bar?
Speaker B:Oh, Mr. Flay.
Speaker B:And go wherever you want.
Speaker B:Bobby went back and started making drinks and handed them out to everybody in the bar and just having a good time.
Speaker B:He just impressed me as just a really kind, generous person and watched him then, you know, grow with all the shows and his restaurants and all the stuff that he's done.
Speaker B:And I'm like, man, if I it help Bobby, I could come up with a Bobby Flay line of products and really help him push it.
Speaker B:I think it would be amazing.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Love that.
Speaker A:So maybe.
Speaker B:Very long answer.
Speaker B:Sorry, Jeff.
Speaker A:That's all right.
Speaker A:This one might even be longer.
Speaker A:What does the fantasy day look like for Amy, and what does it contain for activities?
Speaker B:Okay, you're going to have to repeat that because I got a little funny Internet connection as you were saying that.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:What does a fantasy day.
Speaker B:You were, like, robotized.
Speaker A:Okay, fantasy day for Amy and what activities does it contain?
Speaker B:Do I have to do it in one day?
Speaker A:You can do whatever you want.
Speaker B:It's going to be food involved.
Speaker B:So, you know, a great day for me is being able to learn something new.
Speaker B:I love my barbecue family.
Speaker B:I love every time I'm at an event, you know, that I learn new things with everybody.
Speaker B:But I would love to spend a day with, I think, someone who would be a Thai chef, that I could spend a whole day shopping in the market, going home, preparing food, and then serving a meal to all of my friends.
Speaker B:It was authentic Thai food.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:Excuse me.
Speaker A:If you could erase one mistake from your past.
Speaker A:This is Leanne.
Speaker A:Question, by the way, what would it be and why?
Speaker B:Maybe the bright blue eyeshadow I wore in high school.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:There are no mistakes.
Speaker B:There are no mistakes in our past, Jeff.
Speaker B:Everything is an opportunity to learn and grow.
Speaker B:So if I took anything away, I would have missed an important step to get where I am now.
Speaker B:That's true.
Speaker A:That's true.
Speaker A:So if we put your skills to music, what would the music be?
Speaker B:Which skills are we talking about, Jeff?
Speaker A:Well, whatever you're doing, again, that's up to you, dear.
Speaker A:But let's keep it simple for our audience and so we can still stay on the air here.
Speaker A:Like your cooking skills.
Speaker B:Oh, gosh.
Speaker B:If I'm cooking, I like.
Speaker B:I like the old stuff.
Speaker B:I like the Frank Sinatra and kind of the old crooners that Dean Martin.
Speaker B:Mellow jazz, the.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's just.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:It's relaxing, it's warm, It's.
Speaker B:It's inviting.
Speaker B:And if I can sing along with it, then I'm.
Speaker B:I like to sing in my kitchen.
Speaker B:I don't sing in public.
Speaker B:I never.
Speaker B:I would not sing for a million dollars.
Speaker B:I would not sing to you in this microphone right now.
Speaker B:But when I'm home, puts it around the house.
Speaker B:It's that easy.
Speaker B:Relaxing.
Speaker B:You know, they're kind of like old love songs, and they just give you warm, fuzzy feelings.
Speaker A:Does your kid leave the house when you Start singing.
Speaker B:Oh, he.
Speaker B:If we're in the car and I start singing with the radio, he will like reach over and turn the volume down like, mom, Mom.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:If you were an animal, what would it be?
Speaker B:And why a horse?
Speaker B:They.
Speaker B:I just think they are beautiful, strong, loyal, intelligent.
Speaker B:There's just something.
Speaker B:There's.
Speaker B:There's a grace and beauty to a horse that I don't know many other animals possess.
Speaker A:That's true, actually.
Speaker A:What's the hardest thing about being at, at your level in business?
Speaker A:What's the hardest thing you have to deal with?
Speaker B:The hardest thing for me right now is when we've grown as a company and I don't get to be as hands on with everything that I could before.
Speaker B:It's hard to sometimes have to hand an account or a relationship over to someone else and hope that they're going to take care of that person like I would have taken care of that person.
Speaker B:Because my.
Speaker B:I don't even like to use the word client.
Speaker B:My partners, my business partners become so important to me and such a special part of my family.
Speaker A:Sure.
Speaker B:And as we grow and I've had to delegate things off and we just want you to focus on marketing now.
Speaker B:You said earlier my new title now is strategic relations.
Speaker B:That part of it allows me to still be in the relationships with the people that we partner with, but I'm not necessarily handling the day to day sales with them.
Speaker B:And that does get hard for me sometimes.
Speaker B:So they'll still call me up and say, hey, I need this to happen fast.
Speaker B:Can you make it happen?
Speaker B:And I had to step back and go, you need to call your salesperson.
Speaker B:I'm sorry.
Speaker B:So it's hard to hand things off that you've nurtured.
Speaker A:Sure.
Speaker A:What's one thing you miss about your 20s?
Speaker A:I know you're only 31, but my waistline.
Speaker A:Okay, moving on.
Speaker B:Bills.
Speaker B:30 years in barbecue has not been kind to my waist.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:I think you're both look pretty good.
Speaker A:I spent a lot of time with you both in Texas, so here's a Leanne question for you.
Speaker A:What?
Speaker A:What, what would your last meal be?
Speaker A:On death row?
Speaker B:Well, God, I don't know that I could eat if I knew they were going to put me in a. Oh, come on.
Speaker B:Come up with something the next day.
Speaker B:I don't, I don't know that I could eat probably all the desserts I didn't let myself eat all those years before.
Speaker B:I probably just wanted dessert.
Speaker B:Smorgasbord.
Speaker A:Yeah, there you go.
Speaker A:There you Go.
Speaker A:I think that's pretty good.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:Sweatshirts or formal wear?
Speaker B:Sweatshirts.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:Boxers or briefs?
Speaker B:On me or my partner?
Speaker A:You answer these any way you want.
Speaker A:I can't.
Speaker B:Brief.
Speaker A:Brief.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:Dire Straits, A.C. d.C. Or Billy Ray Cyrus.
Speaker B:A.C. d. C. There you go.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:Your favorite movie?
Speaker B:Clerks.
Speaker A:Clerks?
Speaker B:What's that?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:If you've not seen that, you.
Speaker B:Oh, my God.
Speaker B:Clerks is this awesome movie.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:It was filmed all black and white on a.
Speaker B:Like, a home movie camera for.
Speaker B:I think they said it was a $10,000 budget to make this movie.
Speaker B:And it's a day in the life of a guy that works in a convenience store.
Speaker B:And all the funny, odd people that come.
Speaker A:Huh?
Speaker B:And you will be.
Speaker B:No, this is not for your chariots.
Speaker B:Kevin Smith.
Speaker B:I think it was the first Kevin Smith movie that he ever did before.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker B:Famous.
Speaker B:And it's hysterical.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker A:Got it.
Speaker A:Worst concert you ever attended?
Speaker B:Probably the last time I saw Rod Stewart.
Speaker B:Really?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:He just, with age, has lost so much range and vocal ability that they had redone so many of his songs that I had to listen for several minutes to even know what song he was singing because it just wasn't the same pitch.
Speaker B:It wasn't the same key, was it?
Speaker B:I don't know.
