Michael Symon - Chef and restaurateur - Encore
The salient point of today's discourse revolves around the intersection of culinary artistry and community bonding, as exemplified by our esteemed guest, Chef Michael Simon, renowned for his television presence and culinary ventures. We delve into the nuances of barbecuing, elucidating the significance of live fire cooking, which has been a cornerstone of Simon’s career. He shares insights from his latest project, "Barbecue USA," highlighting the vibrant barbecue culture that fosters camaraderie among competitors, dispelling the notion of rivalry in favor of community spirit. Additionally, Simon reflects on his formative years, revealing how familial ties to food shaped his culinary path and passion. Join us as we explore the intricate relationship between cooking, culture, and connection, all while savoring the rich flavors of barbecue.
Links referenced in this episode:
Companies mentioned in this episode:
- Painted Hills Natural Beef
- Food Network
- Iron Chef America
- Cooked Like an Iron Chef
- The Chew
- Barbecue USA
- Weston Kia
- Heritage Steel
- Gunter Wilhelm
- Creekstone
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
OP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy
Transcript
It's time for Barbecue Nation with jt so fire up your grill, light the charcoal, and get your smoker cooking.
Speaker A:Now, from the Turnito Burnett studios in Portland, here's jt.
Speaker A:This is an encore.
Speaker A:Hey, everybody.
Speaker A:Welcome to the nation.
Speaker A:That's Barbecue Nation.
Speaker A:I'm JT along my co host, co pilot, and co conspirator, Leanne whipping high atop the radio world here in the Turn It, Don't Burn it studios in Portland.
Speaker A:And we welcome all of our affiliates on the Barbecue Nation and USA Radio networks.
Speaker A:We'd like to throw our thanks out to Painted Hills Natural beef from the heart of the Pacific Northwest.
Speaker A:Beef the way nature intended.
Speaker A:You can check them out online at painted hillsnaturalbeef.com Great stuff back.
Speaker A:I was just over the last weekend at their 25th anniversary.
Speaker A:What a party that was.
Speaker A:But that's just going to remain between me and them.
Speaker A:We've got a real treat today.
Speaker A:You know him from television, the Food Network.
Speaker A:He's been on shows like Iron Chef America.
Speaker A:Best thing I ever ate.
Speaker A:Cooked like an Iron Chef.
Speaker A:I the Chew.
Speaker A:He's a writer.
Speaker A:He's done books, he's done magazine stuff.
Speaker A:Michael Simon is joining us with this.
Speaker A:And his new show, Barbecue usa is out on the Food Network.
Speaker A:Michael.
Speaker A:Hey, buddy.
Speaker B:How are you doing, man?
Speaker B:I sound like I've done a lot of stuff.
Speaker B:It never seems like that much when you're doing it, but I'm impressed.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:You know what he didn't say is that you were a chef.
Speaker A:Oh, I forgot that part.
Speaker B:Lost in the accolades.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Michael, if I'd have read all the stuff you've done, it's four pages here.
Speaker A:We'd have to go to the first break before you ever get to say a word, so.
Speaker B:Well, you know, I'm in my 50s now, so I've had a lot of time to accomplish stuff.
Speaker C:Yeah, there you go.
Speaker A:I get that.
Speaker C:Well, you don't look it, that's for sure.
Speaker A:No, you look great.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Keeping busy keeps you young, right?
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Very excited to have you on the show.
Speaker A:What.
Speaker B:Excited to be here.
Speaker A:What prompted you originally, when you were younger, to get into cooking?
Speaker A:We'll get to the barbecue part in a bit, but just generally cooking and what, what really stimulated your interest in that?
Speaker B:You know, I, I know it sounds a little cliche, but I, you know, I grew up in a very food driven family.
Speaker B:I have a Greek Sicilian mother.
Speaker B:So food was always really a big part of our lives.
Speaker B:You know, my mom, until I was probably like 13, was A.
Speaker B:She stayed at home and took care of my sister and I and, you know, cook breakfast, lunch and dinner, basically.
Speaker B:So our whole life kind of revolved around food.
Speaker B:And, you know, when, when you're, when your mother's Greek, is a Sicilian, she cooks a lot, you eat a lot, and you cry a lot, you laugh a lot, you scream a lot.
Speaker B:It's all basically the same emotion, but there's a lot of emotion.
Speaker B:So, you know, I just fell in love with the.
Speaker B:Like, my mom was the best cook on the street by a.
Speaker B:So I really fell in love with watching people come to our house and just the happiness that ensued because of the food that they got to eat that she prepared.
Speaker B:And it sucked me in and, you know, it just brought me in.
Speaker B:And then I got to high school and I was a pretty good athlete.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker B:Had, you know, came from a very middle class family.
Speaker B:My dad worked at Ford Motor Company and I excelled in wrestling and had some like, scholarship offers and things of that nature.
Speaker B:And then had a, a pretty insane injury where I don't know if you could say, like, there's a big zipper on my arm, but I got up 14 screws and, you know, destroy my arm in a wrestling match.
Speaker B:Tried to come back from it my senior year and broke the plate.
Speaker B:Ow.
Speaker B:So what were, you know, I thought wrestling would be, would pay for college basically, because my, you know, my parents really weren't in the position at the time and, you know, the scholarships kind of went away.
Speaker B:So I started working in restaurants to help pay for school and just absolutely immediately was addicted to it.
Speaker B:Like, just, I was a terrible student.
Speaker B:I mean, an awful student.
Speaker B:So like, barely made it through high school.
Speaker B:Probably wouldn't have if I wasn't a jock and just fell in love with the restaurant business.
Speaker B:Like, head over heels with the restaurant business.
Speaker B:And I remember I said, my father, I'm like, you know, I think I want to go to culinary school and like, be a chef.
Speaker B:And he lost his mind.
Speaker B:He's like, you know, you're here.
Speaker B:Like, I was the laborer.
Speaker B:Your grandfather was a laborer.
Speaker B:You're, you know, and at the time, you have to remember this is the 80s, there's no food Network.
Speaker B:There's no, it wasn't like this what people perceived as a glamorous job.
Speaker B:You know, I still don't think it's a, a glamorous job in the sense it's a, you know, it's a hard, very hard job.
Speaker B:But, you know, he's like, I don't want you being a tradesman I want you to get a degree.
Speaker B:And so I went to Cleveland State for a semester because he wanted me to go to college.
Speaker B:And I.
Speaker B:And I got a point to.
Speaker B:Not a two point, a 0.2.
Speaker B:And he's like, how did you get a point to?
Speaker B:I'm like, I don't know.
Speaker B:I didn't go to a single class.
Speaker B:Someone gave me a D, which I thought was very kind of them.
Speaker B:So I obviously, like, that didn't work.
Speaker B:And then my Greek Sicilian mother got involved and said, you know what?
Speaker B:He wants to go to culinary school.
Speaker B:He's going to culinary school.
Speaker B:We're not talking about this anymore at the Conversation.
Speaker B:And I went to the Culinary Institute of America.
Speaker B:And, you know, the rest obviously has worked out very well for me.
Speaker A:So a question about your mom.
Speaker A:How did she combine Greek and Sicilian dishes or those flavors that are so associated with those, you know, Greek and.
Speaker B:Sicilian or Greek and Italian food blend together so nicely.
Speaker B:They're so similar in so many ways.
Speaker B:So, you know, sometimes she cooked Italian, sometimes she cooked Greek, sometimes she melted the two together.
Speaker B:But, yeah, just a tremendous cook, especially with that type of food.
Speaker B:Like, if you told my mother to grill a steak, she would destroy it and hammer it, and it would be like a.
Speaker B:Like a tragedy.
Speaker B:But like, anything that's like a braise or a pasta or, you know, anything kind of slow cooked in that, she probably would be great at barbecue if, like, she had the interest in it because she excelled in food, was like, you know, osso or like a lamb on a spit or, you know, those kinds of things.
Speaker B:But, like, if you just give my mom, like, a rib eye, like, she'll cook it to inches of its death.
Speaker B:Like, she doesn't believe anything should take less than three hours to cook.
Speaker A:Oh, boy, that's.
Speaker A:You know, that's funny because my dad was.
Speaker A:Grew up on a farm, and his meat was always pan fried.
Speaker A:It was potatoes and gravy and some sort of beef every night, once in a while, pork chops was a real treat to get some spaghetti, which was nothing like your mother's, but it was.
Speaker A:It was okay.
Speaker A:But I. I went away to school, and when I came back, I learned what medium rare was, you know, and that.
Speaker A:That was a huge change in the household.
Speaker A:I'll just leave it at that.
Speaker A:But it was huge.
Speaker B:So, yeah, it's fun.
Speaker B:Like, my dad did all the kind of.
Speaker B:Like that.
Speaker B:Like, my dad is.
Speaker B:Is, you know, knock off the horns and wave it over the heat kind of guy.
Speaker B:Yeah, like, he is.
Speaker B:He figured out right away that my mom, like, that's.
Speaker B:She's can't cook those things.
Speaker B:Like, he's a.
Speaker B:My dad likes his meat like he's from Pittsburgh and that's how he likes his meat.
Speaker B:Pittsburgh style, dark and rare in the middle.
Speaker A:Yeah, well, that's.
Speaker A:That, that's interesting that you come from that background.
Speaker A:So when you, when you get to culinary school and you're starting to learn, and when you come home, did you work in the kitchen with your mom ever?
Speaker A:And did she say, no, that's not the way we do it?
Speaker A:Or was she accepting to think, like,.
Speaker B:You know, I cooked with my mom a lot as a kid, and then, like, I would get home and like, I say, mom, try this.
Speaker B:Oh, now you're a chef, and now you're gonna tell me how to cook?
Speaker B:I mean, like, you have to understand, my mother's 4 foot 10, 95 pounds, and I'm scared of it.
Speaker B:6 Foot 4.
Speaker B:I have zero fear of him.
Speaker A:Yeah, I got that.
Speaker A:That was a lot like my house.
Speaker B:So, yeah, her weights are bigger than my mom.
Speaker B:You know, like, like she, you know, when I, I still, when I see her grab a wooden spoon, I still get a little, like, a little.
Speaker A:Yeah, I believe it.
Speaker A:I believe it.
Speaker A:Those wooden spoons hurt like hell.
Speaker A:Man, oh, man, they can do some damage.
Speaker A:So after you went through CIA and you were doing, you were working in some restaurants, how did you gravitate over to, you know, kind of live fire cooking and, and barbecue?
Speaker A:I know it's a transition and it takes a while, but what, what kind of was your emphasis or empathy, whatever that E word is.
Speaker B:He always cooked with a lot of live fire outside of my house as a kid.
Speaker B:But the big transition for me was my first chef job was at a restaurant in Cleveland, Ohio, called Piccolo Mundo.
Speaker B:And I was actually hired as the sous chef.
Speaker B:And about three weeks before the restaurant opened, the chef quit.
Speaker B:And so I ended up being a chef.
Speaker B:I was not ready to be an executive chef.
Speaker B:I was 22 years old, thought I was hot, but way in over my skis.
Speaker B:And the restaurant was owned by a restaurateur named Carl Cagliata, who ended up being a tremendous mentor to me and still is.
Speaker B:And the whole restaurant was live fire.
Speaker B:So we only had four burners on the line.
Speaker B:And then we had a giant wood burning oven, a giant wood burning grill, and a vertical and horizontal spit.
Speaker B:And I just fell in love with that manner of cooking.
Speaker B:I just quickly understood that the amount of flavor that you're able to infuse from cooking over live fire is significantly better than, in my opinion, than, you know, cooking with a, with a pan on a stove.
Speaker A:Sure.
Speaker B:So it became like a very big part of my arsenal.
Speaker B:Every restaurant that we've ever owned or built has those elements in it.
Speaker B: ur first restaurant, Lola, in: Speaker B:We had a small smoker.
Speaker B:You know, we were making all our own bacon and, you know, we were, we were smoking briskets and things like that.
Speaker B:Not in the traditional, like, Texas sense, but choosing like, we would like smoke beef cheeks to fill our pierogi with, like, those kind of things.
Speaker B:So, you know, live fire cooking, basically from when I was in the restaurant business from 22 until now, you know, 52 was just like a really big part of me as a cook and a chef.
Speaker A:Do you remember the first thing you ever, you personally ever cooked over live fire?
Speaker B:Well, yeah, for me, you know, because of my heritage, it was, you know, lambs and goats over spitz for freaking.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:You know, and that, that was from when I was, you know, a kid.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And really like, kid, kid, like five.
Speaker A:We're going to take a break here on Barbecue Nation.
Speaker A:We're going to be back with Michael Simon.
Speaker A:We're going to talk about his new barbecue show, Barbecue usa on Food Network right after this.
Speaker A:Please stay with us.
Speaker D:Ready for a new ride.
Speaker D:Choose from over a thousand vehicles at Weston Kia.
Speaker D:Gas electric or hybrid.
Speaker D:Find it at Oregon's all time leader in Kia sales.
Speaker D: ales of New Kias from January: Speaker A:Hey, everybody, it's Jeff here.
Speaker A:I want to tell you about something really cool.
Speaker A:Heritage steel cookware.
Speaker A:I just got mine.
Speaker A:I do a lot of cooking and it's got five ply construction.
Speaker A:Stay cool handles.
Speaker A:It's titanium strengthened.
Speaker A:It's got all the great stu.
Speaker A:Just go to HeritageSteel us and find out more.
Speaker A:You'll love it.
Speaker A:I guarantee it.
Speaker A:This is an encore.
Speaker A:Welcome back to Barbecue Nation.
Speaker A:Here on the Barbecue Nation and USA Radio Networks.
Speaker A:We'd like to thank Gunter Wilhelm knives.
Speaker A:You can check them out@gunterwilhelm.com if you want to email us, just go to the website barbecue nation jt.com and there is a little thing you can fill out and ask us a question, make a comment.
Speaker A:If, if they're nice, I'll answer them.
Speaker A:If they're not nice, I give them to Leanne and thank You.
Speaker A:Yeah, I know.
Speaker A:I'm always kind like that.
Speaker A:We're talking with Michael Simon today.
Speaker A:Michael's got a new show called Barbecue USA on the Food Network.
Speaker A:How do you pick your.
Speaker A:Where you're going to go, who you're going to feature, what you're going to talk about?
Speaker B:Well, you know, this was the first season, and so, you know, we.
Speaker B:I think we've learned a lot about all of that as we go.
Speaker B:You know, if there's a season two, I think we'll.
Speaker B:We'll expand our boundaries a little bit.
Speaker B:But, you know, initially, like, some of it was just based on the time frame that we were filming.
Speaker B:Like, you know, most of the big events in that.
Speaker B:In the time frame we were filming were KCBS events.
Speaker B:So that kind of dictated a good amount of what we did on the show.
Speaker B:And then we finished in Memphis in May.
Speaker C:So.
Speaker B:And then.
Speaker B:And then the teams, you know, like, some of.
Speaker B:Some teams we have, you know, like, most of the events had around 70 teams.
Speaker B:Memphis and May obviously had a lot more teams than that.
Speaker B:You know, some of the teams I already knew, some of the teams, you know, we researched, too, did good in these events the year before.
Speaker B:And then some of the teams, when we got there, we just loved how they were going about their business.
Speaker B:And, I mean, one good thing about the barbecue world is there's never a lack of characters.
Speaker B:No,.
Speaker C:That is true.
Speaker B:You're never, like, you never go to a barbecue event and go, man, I wish someone had a little bit more personality.
Speaker B:Like, if one person was a personality, we'd be okay.
Speaker B:Like, it is a cast of characters, you know, so we.
Speaker B:A lot of it was just discovery once we got there, you know, unlike a lot of cooking shows where, you know, you do two shows in a day or a show in a day or, you know, that kind of thing.
Speaker B:Like, it was basically taking us three.
Speaker B:Three days or more to do a show.
Speaker B:So, you know, I would show up at the.
Speaker B:Wherever the event was.
Speaker B:We would get there at like 2 in the morning, you know, in the pitch dark, and just walk around with cameras and see what everybody's doing and start talking to people and then build the process from there.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Well, there was plenty of time for golf in between events.
Speaker B:I'm sure I was coming over between events.
Speaker B:I still have restaurants to run.
Speaker A:I thought maybe you threw your clubs in a production truck somewhere and stashed.
Speaker B:I wish, you know, then I would be back to being like a 1, 2, 3 handicap instead of a 6, 7, you know.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:I get it.
Speaker A:I get.
Speaker A:Leanne says she plays, although I've never seen her swing a golf club.
Speaker C:Well, it's hard to do it when I'm on the radio with you, but I do swing.
Speaker C:I'm not very good.
Speaker C:But back to your show.
Speaker C:I will say that I have watched and enjoyed them, and the fact that I know you're kind of tied down to the kcbs, but I did see the gba, and I like that you integrate the other associations into it, because a lot of the KCBS people don't look outside that circle.
Speaker C:And it was very interesting to me.
Speaker C:And also what I really liked about it is I learned from it, you know, and.
Speaker C:And even though I've been cooking a long time and you think you know everything, you don't.
Speaker C:I mean, there's always, like, little tricks.
Speaker C:Like that little mesh tea thing when she was.
Speaker B:Oh, my God, that.
Speaker B:I'm like, are you kidding me?
Speaker B:How did I thought of this?
Speaker B:I'm an idiot.
Speaker B:Like, it was so, like.
Speaker C:Like, it's almost, like, obvious.
Speaker C:But you don't think about it, you know, to have your fine dusting on your final product right before turn in, which most people use shakers or they use their hands, and it's inconsistent.
Speaker C:And her tapping that little T thing, I was just like.
Speaker C:That was my biggest takeaway so far.
Speaker B:The shows that I enjoy doing, what I always try to do in a show is, you know, at the end of the day and in the beginning of my day, I'm a chef, you know, so I always want to, like, I want you.
Speaker B:Obviously, a show has to be entertaining, it has to be fun, it has to keep viewers interested.
Speaker B:But it's always important to me that there's takeaway and that they learn something.
Speaker B:Like, I feel that no differently than when I had these young cooks coming into the restaurant, and I felt the responsibility, and it was my job to get them to the next level.
Speaker B:And I think of it that way a lot when I'm doing tv, too.
Speaker B:Like, for the viewer.
Speaker B:Like, let's learn some things along the way.
Speaker B:And I like you.
Speaker B:You think you've seen it all, but there.
Speaker B:There's not a.
Speaker B:An hour that goes by that I don't learn something new and different every time.
Speaker B:Yeah, let's see how they go about it.
Speaker B:And quite frankly, like, for me, you know, I'm a. I'm a restaurant chef, you know, and in the barbecue restaurants, you know, same thing.
Speaker B:Like, I don't do competition barbecue, you know, I do restaurant barbecue.
Speaker B:And so, like, for Me, it's a lot of learning experience, even through that process, you know, And I agree with.
Speaker B:And some I don't.
Speaker B:And when I don't agree, I tell them, and.
Speaker B:But I enjoy watching the process nonetheless and just seeing how they go about it.
Speaker B:Like, it's just so weird to me that, like, I'm like, someone serves a point, damn it.
Speaker B:Like, why?
Speaker B:Like, you know, like, yeah, like, oh, we're not going to put the burn on the burn.
Speaker B:Burnt ends in.
Speaker B:I'm like, oh, why?
Speaker B:You know, and, like, why, Like, I mean, I would never seem a brisket before I brisket, you know, I cook a brisket, you know, So.
Speaker C:I feel like your show.
Speaker C:Really.
Speaker C:Sorry for interrupting.
Speaker C:I feel like your show really dove in and really showed behind the scenes.
Speaker C:I know just from doing pitmaster shows that they say, okay, just tell us when you don't want the cameras in here.
Speaker C:But I felt like the cameras were very welcomed by the teams and people were really revealing what they do, and I found that very, very interesting as well.
Speaker C:So great job there.
Speaker B:Well, I think, too.
Speaker B:And, I mean, you and I have worked together before, and I think by this point in my career, you know, in television, like, I think people know that they could trust me in the sense, like, I'm not here to make anybody look bad.
Speaker B:You know, I'm great.
Speaker B:And I want people at home to realize how great they are at their craft.
Speaker B:So, like, I always tell them, like, look, this whole.
Speaker B:Like, it's a secret.
Speaker B:Like, it's not really.
Speaker B:Everybody could find it out.
Speaker B:Nowadays, there's the Internet to this, the that.
Speaker B:It's not like, you know, when I started in the restaurant business, if you saw a dish at a restaurant, the only way that you could learn how to make that dish at the restaurant was to work at the restaurant or to know the chef or to know a cook that worked there.
Speaker B:You know, now you could go online and find a million different things and find how people do everything.
Speaker B:So I think that whole it's, you know, it's a secret thing, I've always thought it would, like, people would ask me one of my recipes, I'd give it to them immediately, because at the end of the day, that's.
Speaker B:Why wouldn't you want to share something that's delicious?
Speaker B:And even if it's a competitor or fellow restaurateur or chef or whatever, they still have to execute it.
Speaker A:That's very cool.
Speaker A:We're going to take a break.
Speaker A:We're going to be back with Michael, Simon, Leanne and myself.
Speaker A:Right after this.
Speaker A:You're listening to Barbecue Nation.
Speaker A:Hey, everybody, it's jt And I have eaten.
Speaker A:If you've ever looked at me, you know that.
Speaker A:But I have eaten seafood all over the world, and I can tell you there's no place better than here in Oregon and our Dungeness crab.
Speaker A:If you want to learn more about Oregon Dungeness crab, just go to oregondungeness.org and find out how to cook it, how to catch it, where to buy it, and the sustainability of what they're doing there in the Oregon Crab Commission.
Speaker A:Check it out.
Speaker A:This is an encore.
Speaker A:Welcome back to Barbecue Nation.
Speaker A:I'm JT along with Leanne.
Speaker A:Today we're talking with Michael Simon, and we'd like to thank again the people of Painted Hills.
Speaker A:Natural beef from the heart of the Pacific Northwest.
Speaker A:Beef just like your grandpa used to raise.
Speaker A:If your grandpa raised beef, you can do that, and it is beef the way nature intended.
Speaker A:Painted hillsnaturalbeef.com and, of course, we're on a bazillion different platforms out there, so you can find us very easy.
Speaker A:But instead of me telling you that I'd rather talk to Michael here when you were filming this, Michael, and hopefully you get season two and stuff.
Speaker A:Anything that you saw, like the little tea shaker.
Speaker A:I'm not saying that right, but you know what I'm talking about.
Speaker A:Anything.
Speaker A:Are you going to integrate that or have you integrated that into any of your restaurants?
Speaker B:Yeah, you know, we continue to play around with some things.
Speaker B:I still.
Speaker B:I haven't gotten any yet, but this whole, like, this duck fat spray.
Speaker C:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:I was like.
Speaker B:I'm like, what the.
Speaker B:What are they spraying?
Speaker B:What is that?
Speaker B:I'm like, are they spraying, Pam?
Speaker B:So what are they spraying?
Speaker B:You know, I couldn't figure it out, and I'm like, oh, my God, that's duck fat in a.
Speaker B:In a can.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, so, like, that's something that is super interesting to me, you know?
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:Like, I'll.
Speaker B:I. I will work that into my arsenal both in my barbecue restaurants and my.
Speaker B:You know, I think a lot of them were using it for presentation purposes, to give it a sheen.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker B:But for cooking purposes, I think it definitely has a place.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And you could use it as dishes, like, even at home.
Speaker B:And, like, instead of buying, like, a poor wife, she's not a vegetarian anymore, but she was a vegetarian for 35 years, and she'd go in the fridge and it looked like a, you know, like a fat convention in there.
Speaker B:Like, I'd have beef Fat, pork fat, you know, you name it, all in, like, little tubs everywhere.
Speaker B:So, like, to be able to get duck fat, a little spray can, you know, that, like, so some of those things are fun, you know, the.
Speaker B:A lot of the things I think that people do, and, like, I've eaten it a lot of these people's restaurants, and.
Speaker B:And I know that, like, not all of them have restaurants, but the ones that have restaurants, what they're serving in the restaurant differs a little bit from, yeah, competition, you know, so.
Speaker B:But it is interesting, and it is like, you know, I saw people injecting ribs.
Speaker B:You know, it's not something that I would do, but I do find it interesting, you know, and I learned something, and, like, oh, did that infuse more flavor to that?
Speaker B:Do this, that, you know, so the process is very cool to me and very fun.
Speaker B:And what I really wanted people to see, though, I wanted them to see great food.
Speaker B:I wanted them to learn techniques along the way.
Speaker B:But what I really wanted them to see was this really just tremendous community.
Speaker B:When I kind of, quote, unquote, broke into barbecue 14, 15 years ago, I could have very easily be considered an outsider.
Speaker B:I was this fine dining chef that was always intrigued by live fire cooking and.
Speaker B:And love smoking food and, you know, and all those things.
Speaker B:And, like, 15 years ago, Mike Mills took me in, you know, and he's like, you're my guy.
Speaker B:I'm gonna take care of you, and I'm gonna shoot all these people.
Speaker B:And, you know, you were one of the first chefs to put barbecue guys on tv.
Speaker B:And, you know, so it was.
Speaker B:And it.
Speaker B:It was so amazing to me because the chef world could be a little bit cutthroat, you know, but, like, I was, like, when Mike was walking me around and introducing me to people, like I was.
Speaker B:And I don't know if it was because it was Mike or what or just.
Speaker B:But, like, people just embraced me and, like, let me into their world, so to speak, and the viewer at home to feel that, like, this is how this community is.
Speaker B:This community has a heart, you know, and they care, and they come from different backgrounds and do different things, but there's this real sense of community there.
Speaker B:And in this day and age in the world, to see people, quote, unquote, competing but getting along like that, I think is just a tremendous message to how things should and could be.
Speaker A:Yeah, I think that's spot on because, you know, yeah, they want to win, but they also want to have a good time.
Speaker A:They.
Speaker A:That is part of their extended family.
Speaker A:That barbecue community, that wherever they're competing at, that's all part of their family.
Speaker A:And, and like you say, they'd probably beat each other over the head with a brisket if they screwed up, you know, but at 10 minutes after all the turn in times are done, they'll sit down and have a beer with each other.
Speaker B:So, yeah, they're having beers and shots during the competition.
Speaker A:Well, that's just.
Speaker A:Leanne, that's not.
Speaker C:There's some traditions that have kind of become extended in the wee hours of the morning.
Speaker B:What's that alarm going off?
Speaker B:They're like, oh, first break, I'm like, it's 6:00am.
Speaker A:Well, when we get off the air, I'll share with you a picture, Michael, that Leanne somebody sent me from South Dakota.
Speaker C:No, North Dakota.
Speaker C:Anyway.
Speaker C:It's not.
Speaker C:Anyway.
Speaker C:You know, you're right, though.
Speaker C:It's the camaraderie.
Speaker C:And the thing that's so special about barbecue is that you can bring your kids, you can bring your grandparents.
Speaker C:It isn't restricted to a certain age group.
Speaker C:So that also is, you know, I think it's.
Speaker C:It's commendable as well.
Speaker C:So.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I mean, look, for me, food was always the one thing that brought people together.
Speaker B:And, you know, it was Greek, it's Sicilian food when I was growing up, but it brought people together, brought people around the table, and that's where discussions happened and that's where we learned our lessons, and that's where we learned about life, you know, And I think barbecue is out of any style of cooking does that more than any style of cooking.
Speaker B:Like, there's just something about it that brings a group together and, and you have this kind of natural camaraderie about it.
Speaker B:Even if people disagree on things, and even if, like, some person thinks that, like, the only barbecue in the world comes from Texas, and then someone else thinks, no, it comes from Kansas City.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:Carolinas?
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:Like, there's that kind of funny to me.
Speaker B:It's kind of entertaining.
Speaker B:But at the end of the day, it is a style of cooking and a culture of cooking that just brings people and communities together.
Speaker C:I don't want to get on a tangent, but I am curious, as a restaurateur person in this day and age with your restaurants, are you finding it nearly impossible to make it a profitable business?
Speaker C:Are you hanging in or what's your thought right now?
Speaker B:You know, we have, during the pandemic, we had.
Speaker B:I mean, we closed Lola.
Speaker B:Lola was open 27 years.
Speaker B:You know, that was my baby.
Speaker B:That was the restaurant that put me on the map.
Speaker B:That was everything to me.
Speaker B:But it was very fine dining.
Speaker B:And, you know, people were like, do carryout.
Speaker B:I'm like, oh, yeah, just what people want.
Speaker B:You know, carry out foie grand and caviar.
Speaker B:Just didn't.
Speaker B:We couldn't retool it for the COVID and post Covid world.
Speaker B:And we lost a couple other places and we leaned out a little bit, but we're, you know, margins aren't what they used to be, but we're continuing to fight through it.
Speaker B:The hardest thing for us right now, quite honestly, and not just us, everyone is labor, you know, So I think a lot of people in the restaurant.
Speaker C:Business,.
Speaker B:Like everybody that I know that was in the restaurant business, that's not in the restaurant business now.
Speaker B:It's not like people are like, oh, look, they're just not working.
Speaker B:They're all working.
Speaker B:They just taken different jobs and they realize, like, oh my God, I could work nine.
Speaker B:You mean I could have a job where I work 9 to 5 and then I'm home at 5:30 and have.
Speaker C:Weekends off and have weekends off.
Speaker C:I think I'll do that.
Speaker C:And I don't have to work holidays.
Speaker C:Okay, what was wrong with me all these years?
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker B:Like, it's the only thing I know.
Speaker B:I've done it my whole life.
Speaker B:I know it's the only thing, you know, you've done, you know, so.
Speaker B:But when you do it your whole life, you don't even realize how the rest of the world functions.
Speaker B:But I. I think what happened during COVID was a lot of people were like, I could do what, you know.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Well, you know, here, I don't know where, where you live, Michael, but here there was two things people could do during COVID They could barbecue at home and they could play golf.
Speaker A:And I'm not getting off on a golf tangent, which I sometimes do, but I think that gave them the opportunity to maybe think about things, you know, like what you were just saying about, you know, when this is over.
Speaker A:I or I took a job during it because it was the job I could get.
Speaker A:And it's not a bad thing.
Speaker A:You know, like you said, I've got to got the weekends off.
Speaker A:I get three day weekends once in a while, whatever the story is.
Speaker A:I think that's what happened to a.
Speaker B:Lot of restaurants for Liz and I.
Speaker B:You know, Liz and I opened our first restaurant together 26 years ago.
Speaker B: the restaurant together since: Speaker B:So in restaurants together.
Speaker B:So even for us, like, we reevaluated things.
Speaker B:Like, we just thought differently, you know, like, our kids are like Kyle's.
Speaker B:I have grandchildren, for Christ's sake.
Speaker B:You know, so.
Speaker B:But it allowed us to, you know, Simon's dinners on Food Network happened because all production was shut down.
Speaker B:So we shot the show out of my, with my, you know, niece shooting it on her iPhone and it ended up on Food Network, you know, and so, like, we just figured out things and were able to kind of change things about our lifestyle that I don't want to say made life a little easier.
Speaker B:Easier is not the right word, but it allowed me to spend a little bit more time with my family.
Speaker B:It allowed me to see my grandkids a little bit more, you know, see Kyle a little bit more and just reassess even how I went about my day to day life.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So, you know, I don't think anybody was 100% sure how people would respond to that, but they've responded great.
Speaker C:So that's great.
Speaker C:Congratulations.
Speaker A:Yeah, Cool.
Speaker B:I could finally afford that hair weave.
Speaker A:We're going to take a break and Michael's going to show us his weave.
Speaker A:Coming up on this on Barbecue Nation.
Speaker A:We'll be right back.
Speaker D:Ready for a new ride.
Speaker D:Choose from over a thousand vehicles at Weston Kia Gas, electric or hybrid.
Speaker D:Find it at Oregon's all time leader in Kia sales.
Speaker D: ales of New Kias from January: Speaker A:Hey, everybody, J.T.
Speaker A:Here.
Speaker A:I want to tell you about Hammerstahl knives.
Speaker A:Hammerstahl combines German steel with beautiful and functioning designs.
Speaker A:They're part of the Heritage Steel group, which also does their pots and pans.
Speaker A:So go to heritagesteel US Check out the Hammer Stahl knives.
Speaker A:If you're really into cook, think you're really going to like them.
Speaker A:This is an encore.
Speaker A:Welcome back to Barbecue Nation.
Speaker A:I'm JT along with Leanne Whipping.
Speaker A:We've got Michael Simon with us today.
Speaker A:One question I want to ask you.
Speaker A:What is it?
Speaker A:Because somebody will send me an email if I don't ask this question.
Speaker A:What's your favorite barbecue protein to cook?
Speaker A:Is it.
Speaker A:Is it ribs?
Speaker A:Is it chicken?
Speaker A:Is it brisket?
Speaker A:Is it tri tip?
Speaker A:Is it steaks?
Speaker A:What is it?
Speaker B:I mean, it's not a traditional barbecue cup, but I mean, I love doing pork belly.
Speaker B:You know, they're probably leaning back into my chefiness a little bit.
Speaker B:And I would say if I had to list them, I would say Pork belly, whole hog, brisket.
Speaker A:That's good.
Speaker A:That, that'll keep you busy.
Speaker A:All of those.
Speaker A:It really will.
Speaker B:It's my backyard full of a bunch of stuff which Liz doesn't.
Speaker A:Know that I can, I can imagine.
Speaker A:I can imagine.
Speaker A:When you're doing the show and you, you've mentioned it in an earlier segment and you saw something that you, you don't agree with or you don't understand why they're doing it, and you said you tell them that.
Speaker A:Do you, do you kind of emphasize that in the show or do you just kind of subtly do it?
Speaker B:Well, I don't tell them.
Speaker B:I ask them, like, I'm just curious, like, you know, why do you guys do it that way?
Speaker B:Like, what's the thought process behind this?
Speaker B:You know, and what I've learned a lot about, you know, what I'm continuing to learn about barbecue, competition style barbecue is like, with KCBS and things of that nature.
Speaker B:It's like, you know, it's, it's.
Speaker B:These people are very smart.
Speaker B:They know what's winning and what's not winning and having success.
Speaker B:And you see things change.
Speaker B:And so it's interesting.
Speaker B:I mean, wait till you see how like Memphis and May, how they cook the whole hog and one, it's going to blow your mind.
Speaker B:It still doesn't make sense to me, to be quite honest.
Speaker C:No, when they told me that they were, I'm not going to blow the show.
Speaker C:But when they told me way before that they were going to do this, I was like, I don't understand.
Speaker C:I like, okay, I like the idea, but I don't get it.
Speaker B:And I ate it right, right off the thing and I was just like, I was flabbergasted.
Speaker B:I mean, like, I'm like, I don't get this.
Speaker B:I don't get.
Speaker B:So, I mean, I think America is going to be like, when they.
Speaker B:And that's the great thing about the show.
Speaker B:It's like caught a lot of those things in all different episodes with different products.
Speaker B:It was like, you know, here's a team that just said, this is how we're doing it.
Speaker B:We don't care, and we think it's going to win.
Speaker B:And it did, you know, so it's cool to see.
Speaker B:I mean, it's probably no different, like, with a lot of this stuff.
Speaker B:Like, I remember the, you know, the first time I saw the Robohog and it was like, these people are insane.
Speaker B:You know, and then they won and then all of a sudden everybody's got a Robohog.
Speaker B:You Know, or some kind of like that.
Speaker B:So it's great to see people trying new things.
Speaker B:It's also great to see people, like, really sticking to their guns, and they're like, this is how we do it, you know, win or lose, this is how we do it right?
Speaker B:And they don't change and, you know, like, try to convince Myron that he's doing it wrong.
Speaker B:See how well that goes, you know, not.
Speaker A:Yeah, I think.
Speaker A:I think I'd rather be drugged by a tractor, really, because that's.
Speaker A:That's about as much fun as you'd have doing that.
Speaker A:I can be sure that what's.
Speaker A:What's one thing that you've learned in doing the show, not on the technical side as far as television, but on the cooking side, one thing that really sticks out to you besides the tea strainer,.
Speaker B:You know, a lot of these, I've never.
Speaker B:I've never cooked on the, you know, the upright barrel smokers before, like, that situation.
Speaker B:So, you know, seeing how those work and getting to play around with those a little bit, and actually, Joe Pierce sent me one, so I have one sitting in my back here.
Speaker B:Yeah, he's good like that.
Speaker C:That's awesome.
Speaker B:So, like, and.
Speaker B:And look, What I've learned and I continue to learn is, you know, like, I learned how to barbecue on offset smokers.
Speaker B:Like, that's what I learned on.
Speaker B:And so in my mind, that created the best barbecue.
Speaker B:And then you see another piece of equipment, and you're like, ooh.
Speaker B:You know, and.
Speaker B:And then, like, as I go, I continue to learn and realize that, you know, no different than a traditional kitchen.
Speaker B:Different pieces of equipment, do certain things better than others.
Speaker B:You know, I still.
Speaker B:No one could convince me that, like, anything's going to make a brisket better than an offset.
Speaker B:That's just my opinion.
Speaker C:Are you.
Speaker C:Are you traditional, kind of like old school, low and slow?
Speaker C:Or have you learned or tried the hot and fast method?
Speaker C:And what's your opinion of the two?
Speaker B:I. I've tried both.
Speaker B:I've eaten both.
Speaker B:I haven't been able to nail the hot and fast brisket.
Speaker B:I mean, the first time I had it at Mueller's, I was like, holy crap, this is insane.
Speaker B:Like, why am I wasting all this time?
Speaker B:But I've been able to replicate that success myself.
Speaker B:Yeah, you know, but, like, you know, like, I. I'm not a 225 person, but I'm certainly not a 290 to three and a quarter person.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker B:Yeah, like, right in that, like, 250, 260 range.
Speaker B:And, like, for me, that's where I've had the best success with brisket.
Speaker C:Interesting.
Speaker B:But I also don't rap, you know, like, a lot of people, you know, like, the peach paper and the rap.
Speaker B:And, you know, at our restaurants, like, if I'm at home making a brisket, I'll wrap.
Speaker B: eveland, where we're gonna do: Speaker B:I mean, we wrap out of the smoker, but we don't.
Speaker B:We don't.
Speaker B:We don't wrap in peach paper during the smoke or Texas crutch or anything like that.
Speaker C:You know, it's.
Speaker C:It's a profitability.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:You've got added labor, added ingredients, added supplies, and you just can't do it.
Speaker A:Well.
Speaker B:Yeah, And I also feel, too, like, when you have.
Speaker B:Like, when you have a smoker filled with, you know, £700 of brisket, there's a lot of natural moisture just building up in that smoker that's keeping everything, like, super juicy and.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:Especially when it's humid as hell.
Speaker B:Like, there's plenty of moisture in the air.
Speaker B:And, like, I mean, we learned a lot when we opened up Maples in Vegas.
Speaker B:I was like, there's not a drop of humidity.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:You know, and we fill our.
Speaker B:You know, we have a big oiler there because the place is so big.
Speaker B:We have two huge oilers, and we fill the bottom of it with.
Speaker B:With drippings and water just to get some moisture in there because there's zero humidity in the air.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:Are you doing wagyu in your.
Speaker C:In your restaurants?
Speaker C:I remember seeing a pushback of yours, but you were like, I can't do brisket or sell brisket for less than X amount of dollars.
Speaker C:And everyone's like, that's crazy.
Speaker C:And I get it, because you lose all the money, you know, when you're trimming and cooking and what have you.
Speaker C:But what kind of beef are you cooking in your restaurants?
Speaker B:We do Creekstone.
Speaker C:I love Creekstone.
Speaker B:And we get the creek stone.
Speaker B:We age it a little bit, trim it, and smoke it.
Speaker A:Very, very good.
Speaker A:Michael Simon, thank you so much for joining us on Barbecue Nation.
Speaker A:And don't forget, like we said, his new show, Barbecue usa on Food Network's Monday nights.
Speaker A:And, man, has this been fun.
Speaker A:I think this is the.
Speaker A:This is the most fun interview we've done in a while.
Speaker C:Yes, I agree.
Speaker A:And it's ranked right up there in the top two or three.
Speaker B:That's a bad guess.
Speaker A:We're gonna get out of here.
Speaker A:Don't forget to stick around for after hours, Michael.
Speaker A:Thank you.
Speaker A:What's your name again?
Speaker A:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:Leanne.
Speaker A:Thank you.
Speaker A:And we'll be back next week with another edition of Barbecue Nation.
Speaker A:Take care, everybody, and remember our motto, turn it, don't burn it.
Speaker A:Barbecue Nation is produced by JTSD, LLC Productions in association with Envision and Networks.
Speaker B:And Salem Media Group.
Speaker A:All rights reserved.
